A Gay Muslim?

well, It is my understanding that to be muslim you have to believe in one God and that Muhammad was the last prophet. As far as I understood there were no other criteria. I mean technically one shouldn't have sex before marriage at all but how many muslims out there do? So, why is having sex with someone of the same sex any different? It doesn't neccesarily take away his fundamental belief in Allah and the Quran. And to say someone is muslim or not muslim is not our job - we are not qualified to make that judgement.

Thanks for kicking me out of your organized religion. I wasn't having much fun in it anywayz.

Please feel free to crucify me any time because my dick gets hard on seeing a naked guy instead of a girl - and we all know that we can control when we get sexually excited right? I wish I got excited seeing all the girls - but is it my fault that I don't ? Is it my fault that I fell in love with a guy, or that any crush I've had have been on guys ? Can you control who you fantasize about IN YOUR DREAMS WHEN YOU'RE SLEEPING ?

If a religion (any religion) is suggesting a God who hates gay people, then please explain to me why the same God made me like that ?

So, if your interpretation of Islam includes homosexuality as a sin, then no, gay + Muslim are mutually exclusive. That's pretty obvious.

A few gay muslims I've talked to have a different interpretation (and even Sin once mentioned this on my blog). But to me, that just looks like finding a technical loop-hole to satisfy oneself. I haven't seen those arguments in detail, so I might be wrong here - maybe Sin can clarify this better.

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And anyways, I gave up believing in organized religion not because I'm gay - but because I fail to see why the rituals and practices of one organized religion are superior to other ? My Jewish friends fasted a few days ago - why is their fast inferior to a Muslim's fast ? Rituals started seeming meaningless to me, so I stopped doing them. If I ever find a spiritual meaning to them later in life, I'll admit my mistake.

And yeah - I appreciate you telling me that I'm no longer welcome in your circle, but when I renounced organized religion a few months ago, I was leaving it anywayz.

And all I know of Sin is from following his blog for a few years, but I think he agrees with my views on organized religion also. If he follows this blog, he might come here and correct me if I'm wrong.

Damnit, I knew this was a sensitive topic and could get heated up quicktime. For the record this was not a personal attack against anyone, I only wanted to know if according to the Quran or Shariah Law being Muslim and gay were acceptable.

Dawn ? I believe to an extent we can say whether a person is Muslim or not, simply because there are rules Muslim's must abide by (in order to be Muslim) which are stated in the Quran. What I am curious about are the issues surrounding homosexuality.

You give a good example which I can't argue with. The way I see it is, imagine if there is someone who drinks and claims they are Muslim; this is not possible as it clearly states in the Quran that a Muslim cannot drink alcohol. Only when he stops drinking (for good) then he can be called a Muslim. Not both at the same time.

Jon ? I didn't kick you out of anything (and nor would I want to), you did that all by yourself and your post proves it. I was simply commenting on a subject that I am trying to find an answer to (and I say this in the post). You can appreciate all you want about "you telling me that I'm no longer welcome in your circle" but I don't know where you got that from. It seems like you've taken this personally and gotten uptight about it all.

Fair enough you can't help the way you feel and everyone understands that. I'm wanting to know if being gay and Muslim really is mutually exclusive because there is no point the gays kidding themselves.

If this discussion heats up more than I can handle I may even call a molvi (anonymously ofcourse) and therefore kill my curiosity.

Thank you both for expressing your views.

LOL .. that's okay. Although I have given my views in the above post whether I think gay and muslim are mutually exclusive or not.

I think the popular belief amongst most religious elders / clerics would be that no, its absolutely not allowed.

I've always treated my religion as a very personal thing, mainly because I've found that even maulvis and their ilk, who are ostensibly heterosexual, have no qualms about engaging in paedophilia or abusing the kids who they're supposed to be instructing; in fact, several of my straight friends have commented at one point or another about how their maulvis would make passes--overt ones at that--at them while teaching them to read the Quran.

Quite honestly, the thing that appeals to me about Islam, more so than any other Judeo-Christian religion is the fact that it is meant, at the end of the day, to be a very personal relationship between man and God. There's no religious provision for clerics and imams other than as scholars and perhaps guides, but certainly not as the arbiters of what is and isn't "Islamic". I'd also argue that while I see your point to an extent, your reasoning is flawed: is it possible to be a Muslim if you're heterosexual but a paedophile who molests young females? If heterosexuality is one of the primary criteria of being Muslim, then by that token, as long as there are male and female genital organs involved, everything should fly, right?

Amusingly enough, as a medievalist, I've studied medieval Arabic and read the Quran in the original (with several dictionaries, many years ago). The references to homosexuality, which primarily crop up in the tale of Hazrat Lut are less to do with man-on-man action and taken contextually vs. in a literal translation, warn against sexual relations without consent (rape) and the abuse of the rules of hospitality. One of Islam's most venerable aspects is the fact that unlike other religions, the Quran has stayed true to its original language; reading that language as it was written, instead of just transliterating it reveals an interesting story: the people of Lut's time were insular and xenophobic, and freqeuently murdered/stole from/enslaved travellers. One of their habits when enslaving people was to rape them in order to humiliate and capture them as a means of asserting their own control and authority. It had very little (if anything at all) to do with homosexuality, and more to do with the simple fact that forcing anyone to your will, especially by assaulting them, runs contrary to the tenets of Islam. Reading the Quran from a purposive or teleological, rather than literal, approach makes that abundantly clear.

I could go surah by surah and point out the many differing interpretations on statutes such as not drinking and fasting, etc. (for example, some interpretations regarding alcohol are that the liquour of the date is forbidden, or another one is that drinking to the point of insensibility and/or intoxication is what's forbidden, not simply drinking), but the truth of the matter is that I drink and don't fast not because I simply don't have a great deal of faith, period.

It seems hypocritical to me to abase myself for the safety-net of a religious practice that I don't truly believe in. Until I have that particular faith, and I freely admit that it may come to me later in life, I don't think it's either appropriate or honourable of me to indulge in what would basically be mocking displays of piety. At the end of the day, I think that following certain basic tenets, i.e. those of being a good person, of not harming someone else by lying/cheating/stealing/killing, and of maintaining a social conscience and awareness of what's going on around you (Zakat for example), are more important than following strictly literal interpretations of a religious text. All I really have to say is that I've known I was gay since I was a child (if not the actual word, then at least in terms of my sexual attraction to men), and I have no reason to doubt that I was created this way. In that case, who am I to gainsay the way I've always been? It wasn't a deliberate choice on my part, and for all I know, it may well have been part of a divine design. I refuse to accept labels planted on me by other people who like to rally forth in their own ignorance (not you Toseef, just a general observation here). It's not my place to judge anyone or declare them Muslim or non; that right, if indeed it does exist, is something I as a mortal with my many failings, wouldn't dare to claim. It's not my place to so do...if anyone's, it's God's.

So am I Muslim? Not by a superficial definition, or by a set of particular rules that were made to be flexible and adaptive, but thanks to narrow-minded bigots have been set back millennia. I don't follow any particular faith other than that of trying to not treat people like objects or things to be abused and/or taken advantage of. I'd stack that up against a "pious" maulvi's behaviour any day.

Pinyii..

im with Sin, generally speaking this man knows how to express a decent opinion.

Hunny, open yourself up to the world a little, look outside the box and you will see that nothing in life is black and white. Its all shades of grey.

Faith is individual, if someone thinks of themselves as part of it then thats ok, we pratice what we do for ourselves not for anyone else.

*keep thinking sweety* x

What about Irshad Manji? What about Danial danial.pixelsndots.com?

I completely disagree with the idea that someone commiting a 'sin' is outside the fold of Islam. To be a muslim, one must say the shahadah, simple. There are rules, but a failure to follow them all doesn't make you a non-muslim - it makes you sinful. Where do you draw the line - are you a non-muslim every time you are disrespectful to your parents? Islam has far more to say on this issue than most others. And don't you think that this opinion borders on shirk - you are assuming that you have the divine knowledge of who is and is not a muslim.

i agree with mrs. a - committing sins are a part of being a human being and you don't get thrown out of religion for it.

i no longer believe in religion but i was brought up as muslim and i will embrace any religion i want to, if and when i feel ready. i don't think it is up to anybody around me to judge whether i qualify or whether i should be included or excluded. much as we'd like to treat it that way, this is not a sorority and far more importantly, you (or anyone who decides to make such judgments) are not god.

additionally, although i don't think you meant it that way at all but to be honest, i think that this sort of mentality (of constantly externalizing and judging others instead of being more introspective) is a terrible habit of muslims. instead of focusing on their on character, behavior, deeds, etc., they constantly obsess about others'. islam (at its core) is a beautiful religion and true spirituality is a beautiful thing. focusing on the do's and don'ts, and on the way others are practicing it just detracts from its beauty.

gay and muslim? i dont mean to offend you jon but this is absolutley forbidden in islam. you as a mulim should know what your purpose of life is? which is to follow the commandments of allah shown by our prophet(mohammed peace be upon him) the article does not suggest in any way that you are kicked out of the religion, however your comments are a disgrace and very dissapointing considering you are a fellow muslim. take any religion and being gay is simply wrong no matter what they say as religion is being compramised with these days. u either are a muslim are a muslim and belive in everything that is sed in the quran or you u dont. If there is any part of islam that you dont agree with you simply are not a muslim and will be categorised as a non-muslim, i agree im not one to judge and muslims to commit sins but they realise and regrett their actions not debate the matter.

ahan...the debate...well well well...what shud i say....yea k lets c...i totally agree with Sin...all this is part of the divine....a recent study just proposed that sexuality iz in da mind of a person from even before his birth so there iz no chance u shud blame da person for bieng homosexual...also...gay ppl are as much human as straight people so why don't people just accept dem as they are...dey wont because dey want to follow the teachings they hav been taught...if God wud hav condemned homosexuality den he wouldn't have created gay people... Cummon ppl...Islam iz da most flexible religion dere is and its rules are to modified keeping them along with the time...Religion is for man...not man for religion... furthermore it is not the maulvis who decide who is muslim and who not...dey don't have the authority to do so... as far as people of Prophet Lut are concerned yes they practised Sodomy but they raped the guys and Prophet Lut said to them that here are my daughters but u are only allowed to touch them if u marry them so that makes it clear that homosexuality is not condemned....furthermore those people challenged Prophet Lut that if you are a true prophet then ask your God to send your torment upon us (this is also from Quran)... as stated by Maulvis at several occasion that in Quran it is said "We created you in Partners" well this verse does not imply the partners as in male and female specifically... though bieng straight and a muslim i strictly condemn anti-gayism...cummon ppl are equal in God's eyes...remem Prophet's saying which says that everyone is equal in terms of knowledge, race, caste or creed"...gayism iz not forbidden in islam...the teachings of islam while bieng passed down from generation to generation have been the victim of chinese whisper syndrome...open up your minds ppl...religion is not compromised...it is just "flexibilized"... if u r a muslim and in some very cold place wouldnt u drink brandy to warm yourself??? even doctors advise it coz in cold regions it keeps da blood circulating...noo but u extremists wud die rather than drink brandy but lemme tell u this buster ... if u die then too u wud b punished coz God has made no difference in terms of eating habits wen it comes to life saving...also then u shudn't smoke if u do so coz God has condemned u of hurting urself and by smoking u do damage ur lungs...den u don't remember God...it really hurts to see ppl become too conservative and extremist in terms of religion especially Islam dese days...you are formulate and flexibilize da laws acccording to the mordern time and need...God does not want u to lead life according to his ways otherwise he would have made you angels...da choice is yours and yours onli...not God's yet somehow it is ( well dats another debate)... now if u say dat rules aren't modified and dey shud stay same den check ur books on history of zakaat and saahib-e-nisaab....u wud b surprised...guess i typed too much but surely have raised a few questions to ANTI-GAY people dat arent gay humans...does sun doesn't shine over them or rain resists to fall over dem...think about it

RE:Voice To Be Heard
ARE YOU ON DRUGS OR AN ALCAHOLIC?
I have never in my life heard any BULLSHIT like you have written.

1. A research study will not change the view and teachings of Islam, like the holy quran wont until the day of judgement. There are many pointless studies carried out such as this on a daily basis but that shouldnt surely change the teachings of Islam as the Quran will not!

2.Islam Flexible? Where does it say that in the quran. You have been sent into this world to follow the commandments of Allah not be flexible with his orders!

3. I agree the molvis dont decide who is a muslim because we follow our Prophet(peace be upon him)so regardless of anything we follow everything written in the quran!

4. You mention in the quran it states "We created you in Partners" it is sunnat to get married to an opposite sex. Do you even know the way the kaum-e-lut were punished?

5.You cant drink alcohol in islam so i would rather die but drink, thats purely because as a muslim you have to sacrifice and control your temptation. e.g its natural for a humans to be attracted to each other but if you persue that further by say kissing a gher-mehram that is zinah, a major sin. Therefore you have to make sacrifice to any desire. All would come down to how strong your imaan is, so by drinking to stay alive ........ Im sure you get that by now! (smoking is makruh, but repeating makruh becomes haram)

6."God does not want u to lead life according to his ways otherwise he would have made you angels" .... any point me commenting on that? will just say life is a test and allah is testing you in this world, with all the world affairs does his creation still worship allah and lead the life shown by his prophet? i think youve been led astray by this world you live in and have started interpreting islam in a way that would suit yourself.

Maybe people should just start from scratch when following islam with the five pillars. And for the benefit of every muslim reading this blog including my self i will finish with the kalimah of islam which by the way is NOT FLEXIBLE!

Laa-ilaaha il-lal-laahu muhammadur rasoo-lul-laah

"There is none worthy of worship but Allah and Muhammad(Sallallahu-Alaihi-Wa-Sallam) is Allah's Messenger"

The purpose of this life my brothers and sisters is to follow the commandmants of Allah, success in this life and the life hereafter can only be gained by doing this which has been shown by our prophet. May allah give us all taufeeq ad hidayat to act upon this. ameen.

well all i see by reading wat u have written dat u have done nothing but closed ur eyes upon the issue and r bieng an extremist islamist...reading wat u have written seems like u wud kill every gay person on earth who is gay and muslim or rob him off his rite to be muslim if he is gay...if he prefers men over women wat can he do...i ask u shud he forcefully get into a relationship with a girl and put himself thru mental agony and pain along with destroying life of the woman he marries...no he shudn't...as far as islam bieng flexible is concerned it is if u see and just open ur eyes...in every respect...islam does not demand a person to marry blindly like da mullas say dat u shudn't see a na-mehram girl...it is clearly mentioned dat if u intend to see someone for marriage u shud go to his/her house and see her/him...if dat isn't flexibilty i don't know wat is...as far as Kum-e-lut is considered i think u have not read wat i wrote...da interpretation dat Hazrat Lut offered da men his daughters onli if dey MARRIED dem...dis shows dat islam prohibits RAPE and sex without consent...u wud say family planning is wrong and ummah of Holy Prophet shud be spread and be more in number...do u realize da fact wat agonies does woman goes thru and it affects her health...islam does not demand this dat whoever u find gay u shud kill him...islam is a religion of peace not violence...and i see u have not read ma entire article ... i wrote in case of cold weather if u have to drink wine u shud i did not mention temptation anywhere...doctors too advise it in case of life saving...coz in case of life saving haram iz also halal and if u dont drink to save ur self but rather die u wud b inflicting pain upon urself which is strictly prohibited in islam and therefore smoking too becomes prohibited...approach towards islam should be humanatarian and spiritual rather than extremism... as far as u have mentioned it is sunnat to mention opposite sex it is not farz...dere is a difference and i know kum-e-lut history...islam is the most easiest religion in da world existing today...it provides liberty to both men and women...it is definetly wat is bieng portrayed in afghanistan these days that u keep women within four walls of house...remem Hazrat Khadija also used to trade and was quite free...as far as i see islam is the most flexible religion and u r bieng nothing but an extremist...well a gay man follows Allah's command, perform all rituals of islam den i think he is a gud muslim. God definetly wouldn't want a person to go thru agonizin mental torture and be divided between religion and himself...He loves u more dan 70 mothers...den how can u say dat He wud put his creation thru this pain...as far as choice comes God has given us choice in every respect of life...u wanna be bad be bad u wanna be gud be gud...u perform every ritual of religion and be gay i think dat is justified...and now if u say its sunnat to be married to opposite sex den i wud say it is sunnat to have a beard y dont u have one...it is sunnat for an imam to have a beard not farz...and if u want proof...go to egypt....imams dere are clean shaven...dese moulvi's have changed the entire Islam...women enjoy as much freedom as men but no desee moulvi's go towards an extremist point...open ur eyes and look around islam exists in every field of ur life...i definetly did not interpret islam to suit myself i have jus presented u with facts...ISLAM is flexible and by using this term i mean to imply dat it is enjoins liberties in every aspect of life for the betterment of the person himself...otherwise reading wat u have written a gay person would kill himself and it wud b blamed upon u dat it was due to u dat u made him think and be divided b/w his religion and himself...true islam to certain extent condemns temptation i.e. zinah and with dat comes the fact dat gay men have sex with each other without marriage but temme would U allow gay nikha's so that they can be with each other because they love each other? if dey stop themselves from the temptation of having sex and go through a nikha because dey love each other would u allow it since u sex before marriage is prohibited? think over it God's miracles require cerebral and mental acceptance and islam does provide dat...next time do mention ur email in ur article if u write one i would love to have a chat with u on msn and discuss this issue

I cant believe that my comment in plain simple english did not go into your head. I never said that id kill a gay muslim, im no one to judge but in islam you CANNOT BE GAY! you born like that ...... ok for a minute il believe that but you have to SACRIFICE everything and follow Allah sweets commandmants! i dont follow any molvis, i follow the ways shown by our prophet ...... so I DONT CARE ABOUT EYGPT or anyone else in that matter .... i have a beard and it is SUNNAT-E-MOWKIDAH to have one, meaning you have to have one simple. Drink wine and in paradise there is a river of wine you wont be able to drink from! going to someones's house o see guy/girl isnt flexible at all, thats STANDARD! do you have a problem in saying allah? you keep saying god .... its as simple as this: in life you cant dont whatever you like just because a fellow molvi or big name muslim is doing it, life is a test, a preparation for the hereafter where i state u can be gay or do whatever you like. but for now you dont change as time changes as Islam doesnt. I personally woult hate to talk face to face with a fellow muslim who has view's such as yours, i dont make the rules of islam and neither do u! oh and by the way all the suffering in this world is Allah sweet testing you, dont give in.

well da hate dat u jus mentioned shows wat a coward u r to talk to me on msn...and msn chat iz not face to face...further i didn't say u wud kill a gay man i said it SEEMS frm wat u said...as far as beard is concerned if u can respect this sunnah of Holy Prophet den onli have it otherwise if u keep a beard and use abusive language and do stuff dere iz no need to have a beard coz u wud b disrespectin sunnah of Holy Prophet...when you do grow a beard, don't mock the Sunnah...is it da onli indication of bieng a muslim?..considerin sayin Allah and God...watever u say its one and da same...and atleast i give it a capital letter unlike u...all i say is don't be an extremist in Islam...it is a peaceful religion and all u ppl do is exploit it and accepts its extremism

and if u ever like to chat me to change ma views mayb ... u can add me on msn on p.o.box143hotmail.com

can i just ask who you are to advise me why to keep a beard? dont say your giving me dawat now? Humans are made to make mistake such as swearing so i apologise if i have offended you or used abusive language towards you, was not my intention. But i will say Allah has said that he is the most merciful and will forgie all your sins providing that its from the heart. You jump to conclusions that im an extremist, how can you judge me? you dont even know me at all! If you really feel that it is right for muslims to be gay then why dont you get out of your house and tell your people of Rawalpindi. Maybe your views may change ......

i m definetly not givin u dawat as to acceptin my views all i m askin u is to add me to discuss dis issue....2. i said u SEEM extremist...3. i did not ask u to keep a beard or not i was jus counterin ur views dat it is not necessary to keep a beard...do add me...lookin forward

"it is not necessary to keep a beard" it has been said that whosoever u copy (do nakal) you will sit with on the day of judgement. The prophet will say, you call yourself my follower? You didnt like my face (beard) in the world, i dont like yours today. If following islam without any alterations regardless of circumstances or the so called modern world we live in is extremist they YES I AM! i dont think so ...... nor would i ever want to change as my religion has not changed even a bit. If i had time i would love to come and personaly meet you ... are you gay yourself? i dont chat on msn.

No i m not gay but have some ppl around me who r undergoing the mental torture i had mentioned of earlier as to what to do...Islam is a rational religion it is not necessary wat rules incorporated 1400 yrs ago still go today...and dats not me saying some ppl have.. saw somewhere on site while researching on it...aww u don't cat on msn...okay...where r u from?

IM NOT BEING FUNNY BUT PEOPLE SHOULD TAKE YOU FOR WHO YOU ARE U MITE BE GAY BUT GAYS ARE THE BEST PEOPLE TO BECOME FRIENDS WITH AND THATS A FACT YOU SHOULD'NT JUDGE.

Hi I need someone to help me to regards what I might be GAY, I don't know how I am going to come out with it one day and tell my mum and dad they want to get me married of next year which I am not willing to take.. Please can you help me I am scared. I surpose that the way I am gay so I can't do much...

i totally agree with Samira...ppl shud not be judged on thier sexuality but rather on thier personality...and Adil...as far as u are concerned...i can give u sum advice but i dunno dat if i shud be doing so or not...by interfering into other's life

if u use msn u can add me.... p.o.box143hotmail.com

Constant bickering over technicalities of religion are what distract us from our true purpose in life. Until we realize our inner selves, we will never truly grasp the true meaning of life, love, and god. We have ritualized our religion, drawn borders, and distanced our selves from what truly matters…
I am gay, and I am Muslim. My deep studying of Islam has caused me to surrender to its beauty. Thus, coming to a realization that Islam is a set of guidelines to attain a higher spiritual well being, a type of oneness with mankind. Once this is attained, the latter is irrelevant. Muslims, and non-Muslims, all strive for the same ideas, yet most have been lost along the way with their ritualistic idiosyncrasies, hubris, and finger-pointing.
If you are Muslim, and gay, your relationship with God, your intent and how you conduct your life are what matter. Don’t let anyone else judge you; they’ll never get it right.

msn haseeberhotmail.com

Common people….what has happened to the people of a religion so pure and clean, that even in today’s society tremendously damaged by western culture, its growth is endless. Islam is about pureness, believe in one god, ALLAH and respect to his words and messengers.
when it is clearly forbidden in the Quran that one cannot be gay and call themselves Muslim and when one turns to Islam, they accept all of Allah's conditions including no alcohol, no smoking, and NO HOMOSEXUALITY, why is it that when one of the conditions do not fit your lifestyle or "temptations" that u must run around the bush and either find another meaning for the words printed in the Quran or reasons such as flexibility of a religion to justify your belief.
I am not an extremist and I don't know why in today’s society any man that gets up and defends the true meaning of Islam, they are labelled as extremists....I am a psychology student who has taken an extensive amount of courses in evolution and human biology, so I can say that I can provide numerous well known researches that contradict homosexuality as incurable physiological disease and rather support the idea that homosexuality is just a psychological disorder that can be fixed through correct clinical implementation....I repeat can be FIXED. If you study psychology, you will really learn that there is no one side to a story….every theory has an opposing side.
A religion is introduced to us as humans to shape a culture and fix its wrongs...we are not qualified to pick and choose according to its COMPATIBILITY with our individual lifestyles....don't u see fellow brothers and sisters....Islam is pure. Pure in the sense that it cleanses the dirty in society...and that it is unchanged, meaning the words read today still reflect the words read 1400 years ago...
Now I am not saying that anyone who is gay is the dirt in society….. No, It’s the act of homosexuality that is the dirt....u are only fallen victim to its transgression....
I have been raised in a western country....once I too knew little if anything bout Islam but when I started learning, I have yet no doubt in Islam and its interpretation….and I have had tremendous encounters with non believers that say Islam and homosexuality can live together or rather should live together in peace. But that is what sets Islam apart from other religions such as Christianity. OUR RELIGON IS PURE AND NOT CHANGEABLE. And if Islam was wrong for its strong hold or “inflexibility” then it would not be growing at the rate that it is.
So may I please say that before u customise Islam to fit ur lifestyle...u read this quote from prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) "For ye practice your lusts on men in preference to women: ye are indeed a people transgressing."
Surely I could not have said any more to make such a statement obvious.

well dat practice of lust on men was forcefully rather than with consent if u check out the history

forcefully or by consent, the quote only states that practicing you lusts upon MEN is unacceptable....
the quote innocently states that practicing your lust upon men rather than upon women is unaccpetable...
your interpretation of the quote backed by your unidentified research of history makes one believe that it is unaccpetable to FORCE MEN but acceptable to FORCE YOUR LUSTS UNTO WOMEN....correct me if i am wrong!
Are you saying that our prophet (peace be upon him) meant "For ye FORCEFULLY practice your lusts on men in preference to FORCEFULLY ON women: ye are indeed a people transgressing" when he stated For ye practice your lusts on men in preference to women: ye are indeed a people transgressing

I completely agree with Ahmad, i am a recent convert to Islam myself, and i researced for many many years, every aspect of Islam before converting. The Holy Quran in its wisdom has mentioned Luts people and has mentioned specifically that the sexual lust for men is the issue, not the forced rape of guests who happen to be men. Please stop denying the truth. Also do gay people honestly think that they are the only ones who suffer from pyschological issues that defy islam. What about ppl who have incestual feelings. They will argue that they cant control these feelings too. We all suffer from some sort of hardship but we all fight the urges. This is life.. And after this short existance is a life of eternity. God did not make us this way, on enviroment has influenced our behavior and thus our behavior can be modified

It always surprises me how you think that God the merciful, would banish everyone from the title "muslim" so easily, and I do believe that he would detest a fellow human to be so proud and judgmental and hurtful to someone to call them you are not muslim, and I stress on proud because you think you can call this kafir and you can call this not muslim, Only God knows and you should be carefull with words like haram and god doesnt like you (or what you are doing).

Which brings me to the other point, that gay people are always seen as sex crazed maniacs...that want to live the "gay life style" and thats all there is to there pain, do you know how hard it is to actually grasp this. That God made you something that everyone despises to the core, sees as vile and deviant and messed up and that you are a whore in the making, you are the devils easy food. Do you how brain numbing this makes a person, they cant function anymore, they cant know whats right and what is wrong anymore, they have no will to enjoy anything on this earth, all what they are doing (if the answer is just accept it already you **ggot), with no remorse or acceptance from his bretheren/sisters not even to the life style or the mistakes but to the pain.

But ofcourse he wont, because if you have heard that generaly gay people are extremley kind and empathic, thats because of all this hatered and minority disposal treatment and mind you the divine feeling of being corrupted to the core, makes you understand what it means to be weak in this world, what it means to be discriminated (which muslims seem to advocate that who cares! dont be so touchy be devout instead) discrimination is about not being just to you fellow man, which muslims are feeling less and less obligated to think off.

They feel if someone is drinking/smoking/gay/not muslim from the first place, they have a right to bad mouth him, and call him unworthy of Allahs attention, and judge him, now what is really amusing to me is never mind the fact that you can not be compassionate and understand, but if you are indeed of spiritual depth, and are indeed such a divine servant of God, I just cant see you conceiving the ability to judge so easily and with no remorse, because your head would be tormented by your own sins. Your own journey of understanding religion.

It always surprises me how you think that God the merciful, would banish everyone from the title "muslim" so easily, and I do believe that he would detest a fellow human to be so proud and judgmental and hurtful to someone to call them you are not muslim, and I stress on proud because you think you can call this kafir and you can call this not muslim, Only God knows and you should be carefull with words like haram and god doesnt like you (or what you are doing).

Which brings me to the other point, that gay people are always seen as sex crazed maniacs...that want to live the "gay life style" and thats all there is to there pain, do you know how hard it is to actually grasp this. That God made you something that everyone despises to the core, sees as vile and deviant and messed up and that you are a whore in the making, you are the devils easy food. Do you how brain numbing this makes a person, they cant function anymore, they cant know whats right and what is wrong anymore, they have no will to enjoy anything on this earth, all what they are doing (if the answer is just accept it already you **ggot), with no remorse or acceptance from his bretheren/sisters not even to the life style or the mistakes but to the pain.

But ofcourse he wont, because if you have heard that generaly gay people are extremley kind and empathic, thats because of all this hatered and minority disposal treatment and mind you the divine feeling of being corrupted to the core, makes you understand what it means to be weak in this world, what it means to be discriminated (which muslims seem to advocate that who cares! dont be so touchy be devout instead) discrimination is about not being just to you fellow man, which muslims are feeling less and less obligated to think off.

They feel if someone is drinking/smoking/gay/not muslim from the first place, they have a right to bad mouth him, and call him unworthy of Allahs attention, and judge him, now what is really amusing to me is never mind the fact that you can not be compassionate and understand, but if you are indeed of spiritual depth, and are indeed such a divine servant of God, I just cant see you conceiving the ability to judge so easily and with no remorse, because your head would be tormented by your own sins. Your own journey of understanding religion.

Dam sorry for the double post.

Just one more thing, remember that the prophet when he came to this earth, the world was full of "non Muslims" the only ones he had a problem with are these who were offensive and discriminative of his believes and he was a minority, the least you can do is show understanding and compassion, so that you "represent" your God and Prophet in a humane way, not assume that since you pray/fast (as the blogger obviously is flaunting about) then you have the right to feel superior grounded and oh so divine, that you couldn't care less about your fellow man, you should feel remorse for lost souls rather than contentment/condescending at least to even propagate the religion as a decent one, I am not saying do not say false things about it just to attract, but by no means reject different minds and souls, thats what my desperate/suicidal soul would like to believe for it to be able to live...for now.

From
A gay muslim (or person) who found no salvation of soul from his fellow muslims.

LoL sorry just backing up what Sarah and Ceepo said, stop the dam ritualising of religion
Be more compassionate
Be more spiritual (and try to conceive what that means)
Do not forget your just as human as the next one
And Stop being so dam proud (egoistic) its the last thing a muslim should feel.

I have talked alot I am sorry but its only to help my pain :(.

Oh for the love of it, I will also describes what gay means to a gay person.

You are attracted to you own sex, with variants of taste among gay people them selves, and obviously the bigger problem is you have no attraction "if not repulsed" by females.

Why are you a **ggot?
Well believe me I wish I had a clue, but I must say its the last thing on my mind personally why?? because this kinda of feeling has started since I ever started thinking about sex from the first place so the notorious famous refute is, why are YOU straight..If you answered that we probably have the same answer.

Are you sure??
My God what I would do to find out that I am mildly not sure, and the worse thing is Im pretty sure I am not attracted to females.

Stop being a **ggot!!
Now stopping the attraction, is as stopping your typical adolescent guy not to think about sex, or if he sees an attractive female he doesn't at least gets distracted (Please do not kid your self that you don't), and again being gay to gay people isnt like what most straight people define as having sex..its the attraction its self that torments you and defines the essence of being gay.

It must be behavioral, change your behavior:
Well my only answer to that is, why don't you go be a major in whatever department and rid the world of these beasts, and believe me we would be so grateful you found out the secret ingredient of turning gay people to straight people I know I would, until then don't assume you understand what being gay is or that it is indeed curable unless you have some personal non internet based experience (maybe get rats and apply that behavioral factor of yours).

You must understand this is like spitting on gods idea of reproduction:
You know what drives me nuts about this, is the pain I feel for what humans mean to Allah, so what if a woman cant conceive, she is quiet pointless (well that's how Muslims could easily point her out as), Infertile men??, and most importantly women/men with no luck are seen as lousy and not devout enough.

Just Get married and god will bless:
This the typical Muslim behavior towards deep problems, swipe it under the carpet obviously deceive the wife, or better yet why not marry a lesbian. I believe unlike straights gay people have a deeper understanding, of what it means to live a lie and how that the results of it is most probably an explosion and so much damage it hurts so much people and including your self. So such a step isn't accepted by gays not as "they are just lustful" its cause they fear themselves, they know how brutal the consequences can be, and tbh I believe of course they will be :s. To say the least it is not by any means that simple because of the consequences at hand rather than the desire to simply pursue men.

Gay Muslims Don't exist:
I have nothing to say but see you in Al Akhera Inshallah maybe then you will believe.

Refer to God to control your devil:
Ok, I don't know how that works exactly I do know I am trying, but I demand that as much of a task you ask of me, I ask of you to be forgiving understanding, enlightened about our pain, simple derogatory comments and opinions that you carelessly and not necessarily intently make destroys hearts of little gay Muslims, either making them revert completely and feel shunned, thus choosing the sins since they have no salvation. The idea of self hate is quiet destructive, and when you feel your very fabric of existence vanishes because what people say you are, and doom you as Kafir/or doomed to Hell.

I am through asking for compassion I only forced my self to write this hoping that another gay soul Muslim or not feels that there's one poster that cared enough to elaborate and defend his feelings, and praying to God this has informed you anything about what a Gay person is

Sorry If I abused the Blog.

I accidently ran across your blog while searching for a Ramadan timetable. Nevertheless, your comment whereby you say there's no such thing as a 'gay Muslim'caught my attention.

In a world where judging each other has led to nothing but destruction and war - let's stop it! Secondly, based on a Sahih hadith, a Muslim is anyone who bears witness by one God and Moh'd as his messenger. This includes homosexuals, rapists, murderers, etc UNLESS the person himself/herself declares himself/herself as a non-Muslim, s/he will remain a Muslim. It's not for us to judge and label!

May Allah guide us all.

Wallahu a'lam.

Unfortunately though, in Islam unlike other religions, you cannot benefit in this world or the hereafter by just acknowledging the existence of God. For example, Christians will tell you that as long as you have Jesus in your heart and love him, then all your prayers are answered, people are nicer to you, life is a wonderland and you will also make it to the diner with Jesus when you die!
That is not Islam. In Islam, making the Shahada (bearing witness by one God and Mohamed (PBUH) as his messenger) is the start of the road, and if you think that this is enough for you to be a Muslim...ohhh how wrong you are!
You see in Islam, your level of devotion, to how you live your life, what you eat to how you talk all effect your current daily life and your chance of getting a ticket to heaven..After all that is our goal..right?..this world means nothing more than a test...we can all walk around and call ourselves Muslims...but that will only be fooling the people around us...what matters is what is inside our hearts...and if we ourselves know that Allah is not a friend of the Gay and that he has clearly stated this in the Quran...and we continue to encourage and act on such sinful urges...than we might fool ourselves and the rest of mankind...but Allah knows what is in our hearts!...regardless of how right or innocent we think we are!

Unfortunately though, in Islam unlike other religions, you cannot benefit in this world or the hereafter by just acknowledging the existence of God. For example, Christians will tell you that as long as you have Jesus in your heart and love him, then all your prayers are answered, people are nicer to you, life is a wonderland and you will also make it to the diner with Jesus when you die!
That is not Islam. In Islam, making the Shahada (bearing witness by one God and Mohamed (PBUH) as his messenger) is the start of the road, and if you think that this is enough for you to be a Muslim...ohhh how wrong you are!
You see in Islam, your level of devotion, to how you live your life, what you eat to how you talk all effect your current daily life and your chance of getting a ticket to heaven..After all that is our goal..right?..this world means nothing more than a test...we can all walk around and call ourselves Muslims...but that will only be fooling the people around us...what matters is what is inside our hearts...and if we ourselves know that Allah is not a friend of the Gay and that he has clearly stated this in the Quran...and we continue to encourage and act on such sinful urges...than we might fool ourselves and the rest of mankind...but Allah knows what is in our hearts!...regardless of how right or innocent we think we are!

Unfortunately though, in Islam unlike other religions, you cannot benefit in this world or the hereafter by just acknowledging the existence of God. For example, Christians will tell you that as long as you have Jesus in your heart and love him, then all your prayers are answered, people are nicer to you, life is a wonderland and you will also make it to the diner with Jesus when you die!
That is not Islam. In Islam, making the Shahada (bearing witness by one God and Mohamed (PBUH) as his messenger) is the start of the road, and if you think that this is enough for you to be a Muslim...ohhh how wrong you are!
You see in Islam, your level of devotion, to how you live your life, what you eat to how you talk all effect your current daily life and your chance of getting a ticket to heaven..After all that is our goal..right?..this world means nothing more than a test...we can all walk around and call ourselves Muslims...but that will only be fooling the people around us...what matters is what is inside our hearts...and if we ourselves know that Allah is not a friend of the Gay and that he has clearly stated this in the Quran...and we continue to encourage and act on such sinful urges...than we might fool ourselves and the rest of mankind...but Allah knows what is in our hearts!...regardless of how right or innocent we think we are!

Ahmad
I agree completley but still there is no reason that humans would lack compassion for those who sin, and instead waste energy on calling a certain kind of sinner as unworthy of the "muslim" title u said it your self only God knows whats in the hearts, and the least we can do as muslims is if we find someone struggling with some "sin" "problem" we offer help/understanding and not our personal judgment of what this person "Is"...it is too proud and heart breaking for no reason but pure feeling of superiority..if humans of "good faith" them selves can't understand how that the struggle to be of good faith is different for everyone (for very different circumstances and tests each one has), and instead enjoy shunning people out of a faith for there own sanity's sake (and find it quiet easy to claim who is going to heaven and who is not)...how does some think that this is a "good faith" kind of quality is beyond me.
Allah Knows Best.

Okkkkk,
Brother, please refer to my previous comments about my stand on the difference between gay people and homosexuality. I definitely sympathise with people who are gay and have said several times that they are not the wrong, it is the act of homosexuality that is a transgress. I would also like to say that people with homosexual urges have been put through one of the toughest tests on this life, but imagine what reward you will get for overcoming those urges. Consider two Muslims, one who has an easy life, makes his salat on time, fasts, pays zakat, etc, with not major problems all his life. according to Islam, he will go to heaven, but imagine another person who also completes all his duties as a Muslim, but he/she is also put though a wide spectrum of tests every day, one harder than the other, and this man/woman manages to hold hard to his/her faith and follows through on the text of Allah, imagine for a minute the reward they will receive in the hereafter! Imagine that!